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标题: [硬件改造] 硬件设计缺陷爆料吧 [打印本页]

作者: 9562 时间: 2013-12-7 15:01 标题: 硬件设计缺陷爆料吧

ps 光头最容易坏

土星的卡槽插组装卡会有问题

dc的220v电源发热大，

ps2 光头也容易坏

ngc 色差线设计太麻烦

xbox

360 3红
ps3 死亡黄灯
wii 全砖
请大家补充

作者: firesun 时间: 2013-12-7 15:09

NGC 色差线设计太麻烦这个也算设计缺陷么？

作者: lovecf4444 时间: 2013-12-7 15:10

FC的最初一批原装机的手柄和机器是固定连接在一起的，一旦手柄坏了，就整套机不能用了。

作者: 9562 时间: 2013-12-7 15:19

引用:

原帖由 firesun 于 2013-12-7 15:09 发表
NGC 色差线设计太麻烦这个也算设计缺陷么？

欧版才有rgb 色差需要一个芯片转换，无法自制，这个缺陷真大

wii 都省事，刷欧版有rgb ，刷日美版有s端子，色差任何版本的都有，wii迷你除外，阉割了

作者: yangjuniori 时间: 2013-12-7 15:49

posted by wap, platform: Galaxy S II

我感觉质量差一些对遏制水货有点帮助

作者: 海腹川背 时间: 2013-12-7 15:52

wii玩正版没有任何缺陷吧，质量刚刚的。

作者: HDE 时间: 2013-12-7 16:00

posted by wap, platform: ZTE

引用:

原帖由 @9562 于 2013-12-7 15:19 发表
欧版才有rgb 色差需要一个芯片转换，无法自制，这个缺陷真大

wii 都省事，刷欧版有rgb ，刷日美版有s端子，色差任何版本的都有，wii迷你除外，阉割了

因为不能出山寨的就是缺陷的话那所有不能破解或破解成本高的都是缺陷

作者: 9562 时间: 2013-12-7 16:13

引用:

原帖由 HDE 于 2013-12-7 16:00 发表
posted by wap, platform: ZTE

因为不能出山寨的就是缺陷的话那所有不能破解或破解成本高的都是缺陷

本身完全可以设计出输出色差的，缺要搞这么复杂
我怀疑是为了延续sfc的av接口，导致这样
wii的接口是重新设计的

作者: Nemo_theCaptain 时间: 2013-12-7 16:14

Wii不玩盗版还能变砖？

作者: 逆鳞 时间: 2013-12-7 16:14

posted by wap, platform: Android

同楼上，不同意ngc色差问题。

作者: gill 时间: 2013-12-7 16:42

PS2网卡和主机的接触问题

作者: yuiileo 时间: 2013-12-7 17:11

posted by wap, platform: iPhone

xbox早期不是有啥刮盘之类的么

作者: 古兰佐 时间: 2013-12-7 17:27

WII全砖个毛啊，破解刷机器弄出来的毛病也算是设计缺陷啊，难道厂商设计的时候还必须考虑破解后主机能不能很好运作？

作者: gl434 时间: 2013-12-7 17:29

机器外壳喷漆工艺各种掉色算不算硬伤 ...........

作者: orx 时间: 2013-12-7 17:48

posted by wap, platform: Galaxy Nexus

gba无背光瞎眼机

作者: 老五 时间: 2013-12-7 18:03

FC磁碟机的皮带全新也就用3年还是多说
Q的光驱楼主的老本行哈哈
3DO初代的光头不行 FZ-10的相对皮实点
PCE DUO的主板很容易坏
SS插槽是硬伤原装卡也有几率不出反复插拔很烦的
PCEGT的喇叭功放很容易坏现在中古机多数都是修过的
NOMAD液晶显示差而且容易黄斑
N64手柄的摇杆很脆弱
而且掌机的调节齿轮年代久了都会出问题
其他想起来再说

作者: coldiori 时间: 2013-12-7 19:14

玩gba玩的我近视加深不少

作者: milanello 时间: 2013-12-7 19:17

neo geo cd的读盘速度

作者: luan225 时间: 2013-12-7 20:32

ps 光头下沉(算是共识了)
感觉PS2的缺陷应该是显存设计过小，光头个人觉得还行，用过几台ps2，光头都还算耐操，可能是个体差异
dc 发热大读盘响光头较容易损坏(相比SS差了不少)
SS 双U 性能提升有限且成本高不易开发

[ 本帖最后由 luan225 于 2013-12-7 20:39 编辑 ]

作者: dbq6626 时间: 2013-12-7 21:24

列举一下自己碰到过的
DC光驱那锯木头声
PS换光头
SS加速卡
游牧民的屏幕
FC磁碟机的皮带
360三红

作者: csnlm 时间: 2013-12-7 21:41

posted by wap, platform: Android

初代PSP1000的口键

作者: 火山 时间: 2013-12-7 21:50

我觉得能将ＷＩＩ变砖拿过跟三红与黄灯比，拿ＮＧＣ色差不能自制为缺陷这思路本身也是够缺陷的！
另外ＤＣ最神奇的就是读盘声音，玩正居然比玩盗的声音大，虽然ＤＣ质量本身是够皮实的！

作者: md2 时间: 2013-12-7 22:27

SS插槽我发过帖
是设计人员画蛇添足造成的
SEGA为了避免接触不良的问题设计了一个弹簧卡子，卡心的长度也稍长
过去的卡带需要用力往里插，SS这个设计你轻轻往里放会自动卡到位，但是如果你用力插，就会接触不良。

盗版卡结构稍有不同，于是就灾难了。

还有就是砖头GB的屏幕，对比度和残像极其悲剧，玩惯了的人可能不觉得，我这样偶尔玩几次的人完全无法忍受。
GBP的屏幕比GB强1000倍。

[ 本帖最后由 md2 于 2013-12-7 22:31 编辑 ]

作者: OpEth 时间: 2013-12-8 01:52

posted by wap, platform: UC

wii变砖也是后来的事情，初版是不会变砖的，随便刷，怎么都能救活。。。。。

作者: alexey 时间: 2013-12-8 10:44

GB屏幕残像那是时代的局限，不能算缺陷，当时你要用更好的液晶，就照顾不到电池续航，看看GG那六节电池还扛不了几个钟头的坑爹设计吧。后来GB的后续改良机型屏幕就逐渐好起来了。

作者: alexey 时间: 2013-12-8 10:46

引用:

原帖由 OpEth 于 2013-12-8 01:52 发表
posted by wap, platform: UC

wii变砖也是后来的事情，初版是不会变砖的，随便刷，怎么都能救活。。。。。

多早的算初版机？我的美版机固件版本1.03U不知算不算？

作者: lg19860320 时间: 2013-12-8 15:09

posted by wap, platform: iPhone

早期的记得能救活，能进一个四格画面

作者: jamesxuyiyi 时间: 2013-12-8 18:13

XBOX 汤姆逊光驱挂盘
韩版三星光驱，，其他地方三东光驱（三星东芝合作）出仓困难

作者: DoloresI 时间: 2013-12-9 11:39

GG的电池就没人说吗

作者: SONIC3D 时间: 2013-12-9 12:19

引用:

原帖由 DoloresI 于 2013-12-9 11:39 发表
GG的电池就没人说吗

和nomad比 gg电池问题根本就算不上回事儿

作者: vivo 时间: 2013-12-9 15:16

ndsl的l r失灵缺陷

作者: genesisx 时间: 2013-12-9 16:46

posted by wap, platform: Galaxy S II

PSP摇杆的不方便、1000的方框键风波～GBP坑爹的电池续航力（后来的GBA虽然同样不给力，但好歹人家是五号的，满地都是给力的大容量镍氢电池了）～土星lr键硬邦邦的手感就不用说太多了～PS系十字键斜下真心不好按，按键贴面必须装啊～PS2薄机取消硬盘舱真的……

作者: dbq6626 时间: 2013-12-9 20:56

以当时的技术GG的电池根本不算事脑残的应该算是屏幕设计

作者: chenke 时间: 2013-12-10 13:55

土星的三大设计缺陷

1、Dual CPUs

The Saturn had impressive hardware at the time of its release, but its design, with two CPUs and six other processors, made harnessing this power extremely difficult for developers accustomed to conventional programming. Also, many of the ancillary chips in the system were "off the shelf" components, increasing the complexity of the system because the components were not specifically designed to work together. The hardware also lacked hardware video decompression support, the latter being a major disadvantage during a time when full-motion video was quite popular.

"One very fast central processor would be preferable. I don't think all programmers have the ability to program two CPUs—most can only get about one-and-a-half times the speed you can get from one SH-2. I think that only 1 in 100 programmers are good enough to get this kind of speed [nearly double] out of the Saturn."

—Yu Suzuki reflecting upon Saturn Virtua Fighter development.[8]

The Saturn's dual-CPU architecture was the source of some difficulty for developers. The biggest disadvantage was that both processors shared the same bus and were unable to access the memory registers at the same time. As a result, only one processor could utilize system memory at a time. The 4 KB of cache memory in each CPU was critical to maintaining performance. In general, very careful division of processing, in addition to the already-challenging task of parallelizing the code, was required to get the most out of the Saturn. One example of how the Saturn was utilized was with Virtua Fighter's use of one CPU for each character.[8]
Many of the Saturn's developers, such as Lobotomy Software programmer Ezra Dreisbach, found it difficult to develop for compared to the PlayStation because of its more complex graphics hardware.[9] In order to port Duke Nukem 3D and PowerSlave/Exhumed to the Saturn, Lobotomy Software had to almost entirely rewrite the Build engine to take advantage of the Saturn's unconventional hardware.[9] Also, during testing of an unreleased Quake port for the PlayStation, the Saturn's performance was found to be notably inferior for the game.[9] Arcade conversions like Virtua Fighter were often criticized by the videogame press for its poor, glitchy graphics.
Other developers have contested that the Saturn's shortcomings in these respects are overstated at best. WARP leader Kenji Eno, when asked how WARP managed to produce the impressive 3D visuals of Enemy Zero (a game originally developed for the PlayStation) on the Saturn, replied, "...the PlayStation and the Saturn aren't that different, so moving it[Enemy Zero] to Saturn wasn't too difficult."[10]
Third-party development was initially hindered by the lack of useful software libraries and development tools, requiring developers to write in assembly language to achieve good performance. At least during early Saturn development, programming in assembly could offer a two to fivefold speed increase over C language.[8] To save development costs and time, some programmers would utilize only one CPU, such as with Alien Trilogy.[citation needed] Sega responded to these criticisms by writing new graphics libraries which were claimed to help make development easier.[11] These libraries were presented as a new operating system by Sega of Japan.[11]
Saturn games also improved with time, as with nearly every other console system. One notable example is the Saturn port of Virtua Fighter 2.[11] For instance, later programming techniques employed by Sega's AM2 saw an improvement in performance. Video exists of a canceled version of Shenmue - later released on the Sega Dreamcast - running on a stock Sega Saturn. The video was included in the Dreamcast title Shenmue II.[12][13]

2、Quadrilaterals

Unlike the PlayStation and Nintendo 64 which used triangles as its basic geometric primitive, the Saturn rendered quadrilaterals with forward texture mapping, similar to the 3DO. This proved to be a hindrance because most of the industry's standard design tools were based on triangles, with independent texture UV coordinates specified per vertex. One of the challenges brought forth by quadrilateral-based rendering was problems with textured surfaces containing triangles. In order to make a triangular shaped object, rendering had a fourth side with a length of zero. This technique proved problematic as it caused texture distortion and required careful reworking to achieve the desired appearance - Sega provided tools for remapping textures from UV space into rectangular tiles. These complications can be seen in the Saturn version of Tomb Raider, in which triangular rocks are not rendered as well as other systems' versions of the game.[9]
If used correctly, the quadrilateral rendering of the Saturn had advantages. It could sometimes better approximate perspective than the PlayStation's triangles (linearly interpolated in screenspace),[14] as demonstrated by several cross-platform titles such as Wipeout and Destruction Derby. However, the lack of UV coordinates could produce further problems with clipping textured surfaces - in some games like Sega Rally the UV's would simply be clamped at the near clip plane, although the polygon outlines were clipped correctly. The quadrilateral-focused hardware and a 50% greater amount of video memory also gave the Saturn an advantage for 2D game engines and attracted many developers of role-playing video games, arcade games and traditional 2D fighting games. With creative programming, later games like Burning Rangers were able to achieve true transparency effects on hardware that used simple polygon stipples as a replacement for transparency effects in the past.

3、Cartridge

The cartridge slot gave the potential for adding extra RAM or storage devices for saving games to the system.
Two ROM cartridges were released with Sega Saturn games: one with King of Fighters '95 and the other with Ultraman: Hikari no Kyojin Densetsu. The ROM cartridges contained part of the game data because not enough system RAM was available.
Two different RAM cartridges were released for the system; a 1 MB RAM cart by SNK for King of Fighters '96 and a 4 MB RAM cart by Capcom for X-Men vs. Street Fighter and Marvel Super Heroes vs. Street Fighter. A RAM expansion cartridge was also required for the games Groove on Fight & Final Fight Revenge. Both companies were known for their sprite-based 2D competitive fighting games and many of their subsequent games utilized their respective cartridges (such as Vampire Savior: The Lord of Vampire and Cotton 2: Magical Night Dreams).

作者: 模拟器高手 时间: 2013-12-10 14:25

土星的插卡槽几乎重演32X的悲剧。
DC的发热量和光驱噪音。
XB传说中有刮盘问题。
PS2的散热系统就像个吸尘器，容易弄坏机器。
360，三红。
PS3，死亡黄灯。
老任的机器似乎口碑最好。

作者: 木村浩一 时间: 2013-12-10 22:48

就没人说vb的问题么？

作者: superpip33 时间: 2013-12-12 17:29

posted by wap, platform: Galaxy Note III

dsl断轴

作者: 道克斯 时间: 2013-12-12 20:11

posted by wap, platform: iPhone

引用:

原帖由 @csnlm 于 2013-12-7 21:41 发表
posted by wap, platform: Android

初代PSP1000的口键

还有十字键斜方向

作者: shigeru 时间: 2013-12-12 20:45

1. 3ds 不能破解；
2. Wii 刷机不方便；
3. FC 的单卡只有一个游戏，坑爹；
4. NGC 色差线太贵；
5. PS、SS 初期玩D还得飞盘

其他还有很多很多......机器设计成这样，这么多缺点，厂家真tmd脑残！
对不，撸主？

作者: shigeru 时间: 2013-12-12 20:46

所有的机器，公共的、最大的缺点——

tmd还得花钱！

作者: foxandfox 时间: 2013-12-12 21:41

XBOX一代有一部分光驱容易坏。

作者: 时空之旅01 时间: 2013-12-12 21:49

尼玛，因为破解盗版引发的问题算个毛的设计缺陷啊

不过触摸漂移算不算这个技术本身无法避免的缺陷？不单单指NDS，而是触摸屏就压根无法彻底解决漂移现象？

不过NDS的断轴算得上是设计上的缺陷导致的吧~或者说翻盖的电子产品都无法百分百避免断轴现象~

3DS的压屏可能算是个缺陷~

作者: 咸梅超人 时间: 2013-12-12 21:56

有段时间WII出现过一部分突然全砖的问题，不是盗版盘跨区升级导致的，引起过一段恐慌，经过一段时间后才查出来是蓝牙模块坏了导致的

作者: md2 时间: 2013-12-12 21:58

引用:

原帖由 DoloresI 于 2013-12-9 11:39 发表
GG的电池就没人说吗

貌似当时美国小朋友觉得GG的时间已经够长了

GB能撑到96年再爆发就是因为其他主机在便携方面都和GB没的比

[ 本帖最后由 md2 于 2013-12-12 22:07 编辑 ]

作者: masterking 时间: 2013-12-13 18:20

松下Q的光驱就跟锅巴一样脆，太爱坏！结构和材料强度都不合格！

作者: wyswlg520 时间: 2013-12-21 20:53

早期PS2 5W系列会烧驱动6508IC连带烧光头线圈

作者: jinyibo 时间: 2013-12-21 21:04

posted by wap, platform: Chrome

PS光头容易坏是当时技术所限，不是设计缺陷，游戏光盘比CD音乐碟读取次数多得多。按我说PSONE时代的光头质量好了不少

作者: 9562 时间: 2013-12-21 22:19

引用:

原帖由 masterking 于 2013-12-13 18:20 发表
松下Q的光驱就跟锅巴一样脆，太爱坏！结构和材料强度都不合格！

玻璃面板玻璃心绝配

作者: conda 时间: 2013-12-22 08:20

引用:

原帖由 jinyibo 于 2013-12-21 21:04 发表
posted by wap, platform: Chrome

PS光头容易坏是当时技术所限，不是设计缺陷，游戏光盘比CD音乐碟读取次数多得多。按我说PSONE时代的光头质量好了不少

即使是 1989年产的 PCE 光驱，都比 PS 的质量好很多。
PS 光头比同时代的 CD播放机还要差百倍，包括 SONY 自己的 DISCMAN 唱机。
拆过比 PS 年代更久远的电脑光驱，技术相当先进：光头的移动采用直线电机磁悬浮的技术，全金属的机芯。

反观 PS，全塑料，怎么个“全”概念呢：连根滑轨都舍不得装，光头直接在塑料机架上来回生磨，还有比这更混帐的设计者吗？

[ 本帖最后由 conda 于 2013-12-23 20:37 编辑 ]

作者: dongcho 时间: 2013-12-22 11:25

posted by wap, platform: Chrome

引用:

原帖由 @vivo 于 2013-12-9 15:16 发表
ndsl的l r失灵缺陷

+1
NDS是任天堂掌机里设计缺陷最多的一台机器
LR键失灵
断轴
导电胶非常不耐操
我那台IDSL当时大概一年左右L键开始半失灵，后来LR健都完全废了
断轴出现在第二年
十字键导电胶通了M64就废了
前前后后修了三次
唯一有点是续航时间是最满意的一代，充满电二级亮度可以玩十个小时左右
3DS的LR健终于不坏了，但手感又渣到不行

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